BONUS EPISODE : What do the stars say about your life right now? FIND YOUR COSMIC BLUEPRINT!!!

Transcript generated by AI:

Elizabeth Winkler: 0:20

Welcome to the Shadow and the Light podcast with internationally renowned meditation teacher, davidji.

davidji: 0:27

And heart healer and psychotherapist Elizabeth Winkler, as we guide you through our unique fusion of ancient wisdom and modern psychology.

Elizabeth Winkler: 0:36

Get ready to awaken your true essence, heal your wounds and transform your shadow into light.

Music: 0:46

Heal your wounds and transform your shadow into the light, is here to remove our fears and to bring new life. The light is here to remove our fears and to bring new life. The light is here to remove our fears and to bring new life. The shadow and the light.

Elizabeth Winkler: 1:08

Hi davidji.

davidji: 1:09

Oh, hello, there, Elizabeth.

Elizabeth Winkler: 1:11

Today, we’re going to talk about astrology. This is something that I have found to be incredibly gifting and grounding. Oh my God, I’m so excited To my clients and it’s something that I really started to learn when I was in my 20s. I lived with an astrologer and she taught me a lot and I went in a deep dive. I was going through my first Saturn return, so I’ll just start there. So, Saturn return happens about 27. You know we hear about the 27 year. There’s a lot of death at 27.

davidji: 1:48

Wait. So Saturn returns every 27 years.

Elizabeth Winkler: 1:51

It’s about okay, it’s somewhere between like 26 to 27, 28 years.

davidji: 1:56

Okay, so it happens once in 27 years, right? And then it happens when you-.

Elizabeth Winkler: 2:00

But it’s a two and a half year process, so it’s not a pinpoint. You know these transits are longer, right?

davidji: 2:07

But I have a question. So does it happen somewhere around your 27th birthday? That happens to everybody.

Elizabeth Winkler: 2:15

It happens between like 27 and 30.

davidji: 2:18

And then 54 and 60.

Elizabeth Winkler: 2:20

Yeah, yeah. And so this is a very powerful transit that everyone goes through and a lot of people talk about the 27-year-old club or something like that. It’s what they call it. You know there’s a lot of people that die at that. Yes, it’s a thing. So Saturn is about constriction, okay.

Elizabeth Winkler: 2:50

So when I went through my Saturn return, I knew I was prepared and I was like, okay, I want to go through this really well so that my second Saturn return will be easier, because how you navigate your first one kind of affects the second. Your Saturn return is really letting go of the shoulds in your life. So let me illustrate how this could be. So typically between 27 and 30, there’s major change. You are not the same person you were before your Saturn return. So often if you’re in a relationship, often it will end, or maybe you get married or you have a child or you change your career. Now some people will do what they should do. I know somebody who in their first Saturn return, he followed his family, rule his shoulds, he took over his family business and that was what happened in his first Saturn return. In his second Saturn return, closer to you know, in later 50s, he was facing deep depression, suicidal stuff. He got through it, but that’s a good example of it coming up again the second time and really having to face who am I and what do I truly deeply desire.

Elizabeth Winkler: 3:51

When I went through mine the first time, I was aware of all that and so I wanted to do it very consciously. But all my friends that had already gone through it were like I remember I actually had a birthday party which was centered around it and people were like it’s going to be okay. It’s going to be okay. And the way I described my Saturn return was I felt like a I know this is going to sound so intense, but I just have to be honest. I felt like a chicken that was plucked feather by feather, because it’s a stripping away. It’s a stripping away of what you think you are.

Elizabeth Winkler: 4:26

Anyone who’s beyond their 20s knows about this. You know that your 20s are very difficult can be a very transformational time. Anyway, the Saturn return was what brought me into astrology. Well, I mean, I was studying it before that, but that’s when I really dove into it, and so I thought I would just go into some different grounding aspects of astrology. So we have your zodiac sign and there are fire signs, there are earth signs, there are air signs and there are water signs, and so I can name all of that.

davidji: 5:03

That would be helpful in case you don’t know, there’s like four cardinal signs too, so maybe you could start at that point. And then what are the other signs within those, because I’m a Taurus.

Elizabeth Winkler: 5:14

So you’re fixed. So a Taurus is a earth sign, right, and it is also fixed. I am a air sign, I’m an Aquarius, but I’m also fixed. Okay, scorpio is a water sign, but it’s also fixed.

davidji: 5:31

Then we could go to, and this means what Fixed.

Elizabeth Winkler: 5:35

Fixed. I don’t know, you’re a little stubborn.

davidji: 5:38

Oh, think of fixed energy, because they always say, oh, taurus is so, they’re so stubborn, but Aquarius too. Right, take a drive with Elizabeth and I as we drive. Oh yeah, we experienced that yesterday.

Elizabeth Winkler: 5:50

Remember he was telling me how to park, Okay, and I’m like I’m going to do it my way.

davidji: 5:56

So you know, Aquarians like to do it, not how to park, where to park and then what direction to face.

Elizabeth Winkler: 6:02

Yes, and we were complete opposite. And guess who won? The one that was driving. Not that this is about winning and losing, but anyway.

davidji: 6:13

I actually thought I won.

Elizabeth Winkler: 6:15

Oh, how did you win?

davidji: 6:16

Tell me, Because I said you know what I’m just going to surrender.

Elizabeth Winkler: 6:19

That’s right. Well, that’s perfect. So we both won Right. So I both won Right. So I’m a Taurus rising. Okay. So we have our sun sign, which is where the sun was in the sky. So the sun was in Taurus when you were born. The sun was in Aquarius when I was born, Mateo do you know what your sign? Is Libra. Okay, so the sun was in Libra, which is an air sign, and Libra is a cardinal, I believe right, cardinal, because it’s the beginning of fall right, oh, so the cardinal signs are Begin the seasons.

davidji: 6:55

Begin the seasons, oh, brilliant. So Capricorn Aries, I think no one knew that. I think we all just learned that one. I mean, you knew that, of course. Libra, I think we all just learned that one. I was always wondering what is that whole cardinal sign?

Elizabeth Winkler: 7:07

Anyway, we have our sun sign. We also have our moon sign where the moon was, and that’s your emotional. So your sun sign is like your core identity, like who you feel. Probably you identify with being a Libra, mateo. Does that make sense to you, if you know anything about it? And davidji maybe you identify with the Taurus aspects of you. I definitely feel very Aquarian, but then there’s the moon. The moon is how you are emotionally, so that’s different. Do you know what your moon sign is, matteo? Do you know what your moon sign is? davidji, maybe you do. You’re thinking. It looks like you’re thinking, I’m thinking, I’m thinking. Maybe you do. You’re thinking. It looks like you’re thinking, I’m thinking, I’m thinking my moon is in Gemini, so my moon is in an air sign, and that is your emotions, how you are in emotional life.

Elizabeth Winkler: 7:52

Okay, and then there’s your rising. So people always ask you you’re three, what’s your moon, what’s your sun, what’s your rising? Your rising is really interesting because it’s what other people think you are. So my rising is Taurus. So people think I’m a Taurus. I mean the way that that manifests in my life is like people always say I’m very strong because a Taurus is very strong. I might not necessarily identify with that, but it’s how I’m seen. Okay, does anyone in here know what their rising is? It’s easy to figure this out, okay?

Elizabeth Winkler: 8:22

So if you want to know what your sun, moon and rising are, all you got to do is go to astrocom and put in your information. What do you need? You need the time you were born. This is important that you have accurate information. So, birth certificate, the time you were born, the date you were born and where so the location. If you were born in the hospital, where was the hospital? So, like my children were were born, and where so the location. If you were born in a hospital, where was the hospital? So, like, my children were born in Santa Monica. So I put in Santa Monica, I don’t put in Los Angeles. Just that little tidbit.

Elizabeth Winkler: 8:53

And then the time minute that will help place where everything is in the houses. There are 12 houses in your chart, so there is a snapshot when you were born of where everything was where the sun is, where the moon is, what was rising on the horizon, where your Mercury was. So Mercury is about communication and your mind. Your Venus is about love and money and abundance. Your Mars is about action, how you are out in the world, ambition and drive can also be about anger. So these are just some little pieces to it all, and where your sun is placed to me is something that I really pay a lot of attention to. I think I have your chart, but I’m not. I’m not sure. Anyway, my son, as an example, is in the 10th house, so the 10th house is about career and being out in the world. So my career has always been like a third child to me. I have two children and then my career is also like a child to me, so we have so much going on all the time.

Elizabeth Winkler: 10:11

The moon moves around your entire chart every 28 days, so the moon is shifting and changing every couple of days. The sun does its return once a year. That’s your, and, as we just said, the saturn is about like 28 years, let’s say. And then we have, you know, these are slower moving planets that are affecting how generations are, with our generational, like generation x or all that is is also connected to astrology. So we just had this major change that people may have heard about Pluto moving into Aquarius. So Pluto is about death and transformation. Think of the chrysalis, right, okay, the caterpillar butterfly. And so Pluto has been in Capricorn for the last 20 years, and when it first went into Capricorn, we had a major upheaval in the financial world. Capricorn is about finance, it’s about money, it’s about material world. So when Pluto moved in, we had like a stock market issue and then we just came out of it and it moved into Aquarius.

Elizabeth Winkler: 11:23

What people are talking about with Pluto and Aquarius is AI technological advancements. There’s conversation around connecting to other realms of life, whether that be through meditative practice, it could also be through medicinal mushrooms and things like that. So moving to other levels of reality or even space travel, and that advancement. That’s a huge part of it. And also Aquarius I can speak to Aquarius because I am one are all about humanity and connecting on the human level, and so Pluto being about social transformation in the world, coming together as a human family.

Elizabeth Winkler: 12:10

How do we learn up from down? Well, we have to know down. So we see a lot of division in the world. You might be like well, I don’t feel like there’s a lot of unity. That is what Aquarius is about, but often you have to have the opposite in order to bring forward the connection. So there is a lot of divisiveness in our world right now, which is the beginning of this time, this change of Pluto and Aquarius. So that’s just a thought I’m having in this moment about it. Aquarius is about revolution. It’s ruled by the planet Uranus. So Uranus is like a thunderbolt of lightning. It’s sudden change, transformation. It’s also stroke of genius. It’s where we get great ideas, new ideas, revolution. So there are a lot of thoughts about what will happen. We also have two new planets, so Pluto is in Aquarius for the next 20 years, but we’re going to have my.

davidji: 13:04

Pluto is in Aquarius for the next 20 years. But we’re going to have. My moon is in Aquarius.

Elizabeth Winkler: 13:06

Well, that makes sense, because my rising is in Taurus.

davidji: 13:10

That’s crazy.

Elizabeth Winkler: 13:12

No, it makes total sense because that’s probably why we have this connection. Your moon and my sun are in the same sign and when you have that, I have that with other people in my life who I feel very connected to, when your moon and sun are conjunct. So you can do like a relational chart to see these sorts of things there’s composite charts or synastry charts, etc.

davidji: 13:36

Based on that, it looks like our podcast is going to run for at least another 50 years.

Elizabeth Winkler: 13:40

Well, we could do. Actually, you know what I haven’t done.

davidji: 13:43

We could do a chart for the podcast for the podcast.

Elizabeth Winkler: 13:48

We could people do that. So america just went through its pluto return okay, 1776, to when pluto came back to where it was, when that declaration of independence and that was when that started to happen in 2020, you started to feel it. We were seeing all of these things that the nation was built on coming up in a lot of change. We had the Black Lives Matter movement. We’ve had a lot of things come forward that people weren’t seeing before or looking at, and so all of these different things a lot of astrologers are talking about this is the transformation Pluto brings forward, what we haven’t been looking at. So it’s about transformation. It’s about the shadow.

Elizabeth Winkler: 14:34

It’s very funny because my son is an Aquarius at three degrees Pluto’s. Now I think I don’t know if it’s at one yet, but it’s approaching my son in the 10th house and I’m doing a podcast with you about the shadow and the light. Which is my son is the light. Pluto is the shadow. So my work has been all about shadow work and that makes a lot of sense. How do I bring this into people’s lives? So if you want to go on astrocom, pull up your chart then you’ll see where everything was placed. I do have a question.

davidji: 15:08

I have always been a believer in various different tools to help us, whether it’s a DRI arc or whether it’s your chart or whether it’s a Nadi Pamli, for whatever the thing is that’s out there again to give you the bigger picture. So I don’t know that when you look at your chart it doesn’t say, oh, here’s what’s going to happen in your life. It sort of kind of says, here’s where you’re heading, but we have the choice to lean harder into that direction or to resist it and push back. We may suffer and struggle and end up at the same place, but just because your chart says here’s what’s likely to unfold, or here’s how the stars are moving and here’s how you are moving towards this thing. So if you could just speak just for a moment before you dive into this concept. This isn’t carved in stone. This is sort of like laying out a potential map and we get to sort of like translate it or interpret it into our own personal lives of what that actually means.

Elizabeth Winkler: 16:15

Absolutely. It isn’t predictive. Okay, it’s talking about energy. Everything is energy. As an example, mars I was talking about will, ambition.

Elizabeth Winkler: 16:27

It also can be anger, rage, if Mars is aspecting some part of your chart. This is something I look at. My clients are like let’s look at my chart and see what’s happening. If there is an aspect of Mars over something or it’s squaring or sextiling or trining or whatever it may be, you can use that to your advantage. So if you’re unconscious of it, you could be really angry, you could be really frustrated, because Mars can create that. It can create a lot of fire or frustration. Or you can use it to be creative. Mars is very creative. It rules Aries. Aries is a very creative sign, and so I had a client who was struggling with a lot of rage. She had a lot of Mars stuff in her chart and aspects and I said, okay, instead of a meditation practice, we did a creativity practice and it transformed her anger. So that’s like a small example that was hugely transformational in this person’s life.

Elizabeth Winkler: 17:25

Everything has its shadow side and its light side, and so Saturn. I was talking about Saturn at the beginning. Saturn is about restriction. Think about pumping on the brakes. That is Saturn.

davidji: 17:40

Tap, tap.

Elizabeth Winkler: 17:40

It very much. It’s like a vice. It can give focus. It can give focus, it can create structure. So if you’re in a Saturn return and you have more structure in your life, you have more focus. You’re releasing shoulds, you’re connecting to your true being. That is what it’s all about. If you work with the energy, it will support you. If you resist it, it’s really difficult. So Pluto and Aquarius do not resist Pluto, whatever it’s transforming in your life. Allow that. Look at where Pluto and Aquarius is in your chart. There is going to be transformation for you. But we do have three other planets moving. So we just went through this huge change of Pluto. It’s a big deal, but we have Neptune, saturn and Uranus all shifting as well this year. Neptune and Saturn are moving into Aries this year and Uranus transitions into Gemini, so it’s going to be Aries. Those are both. That’s fire. Gemini is air and Pluto is an Aquarius, which is air. So fire and air signs are really going to feel this. If you’re a fire sign or an air, everyone’s going to feel it.

davidji: 18:55

So that’s why you need us earth signs to help you, because we will not be spun out as much as everybody else.

Elizabeth Winkler: 19:02

You mentioned that your moon is in Aquarius, so Pluto’s moving towards your moon. I’m not sure what degree your moon is, but that’s going to transform something in your emotional being potentially.

davidji: 19:14

Yeah, that’s true, right, sorry.

Elizabeth Winkler: 19:16

Well, let me just, as you’re pulling up your chart. We talked about cardinal signs, so the cardinal just to name it, because I didn’t name them all Aries, because that’s the beginning of spring, right. Cancer, beginning of summer. Libra, beginning of autumn. Capricorn, beginning of winter. So Aries tends to initiate with bold action and confidence. That’s Aries, ruled by Mars. Cancer is ruled by the moon.

Elizabeth Winkler: 19:41

Cancer is known as being very Cancer is ruled by the moon. Cancer is known as being very, a lot of emotion. The moon is a big thing I pay attention to with clients. The reason I started to integrate this work into my clients was because I’d have one person after the next say I was crying on Saturday about whatever. Then another person I was so upset on Saturday, another person gosh, I don’t know what it was. This weekend was really tough, really heavy for me. So different versions of this. And guess what happened on Saturday? Full moon. So I started to look at that and then you can use the full moon to let go, because full moons are about illuminating something and releasing and you can do ritual and big on that. Also, I do have a houses of astrology handout on elizabethwinklercom. We can also put a link to that on the shadow and the light podcast for you, so that you have a breakdown of every single house, what it represents, so you can pay attention to when it’s a full moon and a new moon.

Elizabeth Winkler: 20:45

Okay, so Aries are initiating with bold action. Cancer, as I said, ruled by the moon. Libra, matteo, seeks balance and initiates partnerships all about relationships. Ruled by Venus. Capricorn is ruled by Saturn. So hard work. We talked about Saturn earlier. They work really hard. They’re about building and leading towards long-term goals. So those are the cardinal signs, but we have all of that in our chart, so it doesn’t matter if you’re not any of those.

davidji: 21:18

All of those energies are in your chart somewhere. What did I say? My moon was Aquarius Aquarius, and my ascendant is Virgo. Okay, so what do you think? My sun sign’s Taurus, my moon sign is Aquarius and my ascendant is Virgo.

Elizabeth Winkler: 21:32

Okay, I’m going to go over it, but let me just finish going through the fixed and all this. Okay, so the fixed signs are we were naming Aquarius, which is ruled by Uranus, and Aquarians are very much about visionary ideas, innovation. We have Scorpio, which is ruled by Pluto. So when we think of Scorpios, we think of like. Often a lot of people think like dark and things like that. It’s about transformation. It’s emotionally deep.

Elizabeth Winkler: 22:05

I think Scorpios are very, very deep human beings and very transformational and they look at like they. You know secrets can be revealed and they can transform that A lot of power there. Leos are ruled by the sun and they are very creative and leaders, and Taurus ruled by Venus. They’re known to be good with money. All earth signs are Material security, persistence. Tauruses I don’t know if you identify with this, but it’s very true for many that they’re like slow and steady wins the race. They move through things. Does that resonate with you at all? Sometimes, yeah, it’s like very methodical in the way that they do things. I am data driven. I like that.

davidji: 22:56

I love data-driven. I like that I love data yeah, can’t get enough, right, but I also love chocolate and Taurus also.

Elizabeth Winkler: 23:06

Oh, they’re known for that. They’re known for food Taking care of themselves. For loving food.

davidji: 23:11

Hedonistic.

Elizabeth Winkler: 23:12

Yes, food and touch. Physical, like soft blankets.

davidji: 23:17

Right.

Elizabeth Winkler: 23:18

Like that very important.

davidji: 23:19

Very, very soft massage, that’s the Venus.

Elizabeth Winkler: 23:22

So do you have that?

davidji: 23:23

too, Libra.

Elizabeth Winkler: 23:24

Do you like the physical touch? Because it’s very Venus. It’s a very Venus thing, I think. Personally, this is my projection. Okay, then we have the mutable signs, so that’s Gemini, virgo, sagittarius, pisces. So when you’re mutable, you’re adaptable, flexible, curious, resourceful. They thrive in transition.

davidji: 23:48

My book Secrets of Meditation is a Virgo.

Elizabeth Winkler: 23:52

Okay, so it’s transition.

davidji: 23:54

September 4th. It’s what September 4th? It was released it’s launch date. So my first official book that I put into the world was a Virgo and had like a big Virgo celebration.

Elizabeth Winkler: 24:07

Interesting. So the mutable signs are in between the cardinal, which is the initiation Right, and the mutable is the transition. So it’s bringing closure to a cycle and preparing for the new beginning.

davidji: 24:19

Right, right. I think one of the major teachings of just having a conversation like this is energy is changing constantly and there is some kind of structure to it, but knowing where you are in the wave, just like the three arcs, really can help you understand. Again, not predictive of the future, but just talk for a moment about this concept of fate.

Elizabeth Winkler: 24:44

Okay, I will. But for all those people that are mutable signs, I didn’t get to hear. I need to finish that, can.

davidji: 24:49

I finish that.

Elizabeth Winkler: 24:51

Sure Okay so.

davidji: 24:51

I’m asking too many questions, so by the time you’re done with this, you’re going to have to answer, like my 20 questions.

Elizabeth Winkler: 24:56

So we have in the mutable science, we have Gemini and I’m a Gemini moon. Geminis are known for communication, big on communication.

davidji: 25:05

You said something about ideas In Jyotish which is not sun sign but moon signs in India. I’m a Gemini.

Elizabeth Winkler: 25:13

Oh, yeah, yeah. So they adapt through communication and intellectual exploration. They love to take in information. So Geminis are ruled by Mercury. Virgos they’re about details and practical solutions. Virgos are ruled by Mercury, just like Gemini. And then Sagittarius I think of playfulness with Sagittarians and they expand horizons, they explore philosophy and physical journeys. And Sagittarius is ruled by Jupiter. So Jupiter is all about expansion, abundance, and Sagittarians are ruled by that. So it’s like high mind thinking, like higher levels of thinking. And then Pisces, ruled by Neptune. Pisces are all about spirituality, also emotion, because it’s a water sign, and empathy. So the shadow side of mutable signs is that they can lack focus and seem inconsistent. The shadow side of fixed signs is that they may resist change or be too rigid. The shadow side to the cardinals is they can lack follow through or sustainability. So just wanted to give like a overview of those different things.

davidji: 26:34

Yeah, and if you missed yours because you suddenly were paying attention to traffic while you were driving or somebody spoke in the background, just replay this and you can really tap into that aspect of yourself. Okay, elizabeth, I asked like 10 questions and tried to interrupt you during your revealing of this.

Elizabeth Winkler: 26:52

I just think that paying some attention to this and exploring how things are affecting your chart and looking back at what was going on when you were in your first Saturn return. If you are beyond that now, what changed? Because you’re going to go through it again and what’s going to be another level of that. So, Saturn return how is Pluto affecting you? How Mars moves around? Right now we’re in a Mars retrograde. It’s a huge effect on us, so it’s just the moon.

davidji: 27:22

What’s the effect that Mars retrograde has on us. We’re all familiar with the Mercury retrograde Don’t sign contracts, don’t get into technical details, don’t buy a car and we’re always seemingly in Mercury in retrograde, so you can never do anything. Actually, a lot of times when people say Mercury’s in retrograde again, my typical response is rolling my eyes. But what does Mars in retrograde do?

Elizabeth Winkler: 27:43

Well, mars is about action, drive, will. It can also be about anger and things like that. It has passion, desire, action, bringing things out into the world. So Mars moves over, let’s say, your second house. Your second house is about your income, your money. Okay, so let’s say that Mars moves across the second house and then it moves into the third, which is about communication, your siblings, et cetera, and then it turns retrograde and it goes backwards what seems like backwards towards the second house, back to money and income. So it already went over the second house, back to money and income. So it already went over the second house, and maybe you were planting seeds at that time of different ways. I’m going to go out into the world.

Elizabeth Winkler: 28:27

Okay, the first time it went over and then, as it retrogrades back over it, you could be fertilizing that soil with reflection when you’re in a retrograde.

Elizabeth Winkler: 28:40

Be fertilizing that soil with reflection.

Elizabeth Winkler: 28:41

When you’re in a retrograde, it’s a time to be reflective, to ask questions of yourself, to have more of an internal focus.

Elizabeth Winkler: 28:47

So things may be delayed at that time or you could feel blocked, like it’s harder to initiate.

Elizabeth Winkler: 28:54

It’s not negative, but it’s in time to be reflective when it’s retrograding and look at reassessing what fuels your passion and whether you’re pursuing that in the way that you desire, how that is feeling anger or anything like that, because it can also come in that form to reflect more on how you can redirect your frustrations, maybe in a more effective way, or it might bring up anger that you didn’t realize you had and be a time to explore that and to look at that tension in your body or in your mind or in your heart and how you can redirect the energy.

Elizabeth Winkler: 29:36

So that’s like this time of reflection of I think of it as also fertilizing. So then it will come back into a direct motion. Then you see more of the fruition of what you had first laid the seeds, using a retrograde time to be reflective and ask yourself questions and refine. You talk about this a lot and then you, as you go direct, then the fruition of that desire will come into your life. Right, mars retrograde happens every like 26 months, like almost yeah, like a little over two years.

Elizabeth Winkler: 30:15

It happens and we’re in it now. So’s a powerful time, and so here’s some journaling prompts for mars retrograde. What are the actions or goals that are feeling stuck? What did I set into motion? Is there anything I want to refine around that?

davidji: 30:33

these are awareness tools, that’s that’s really the most, but these are opportunities for us. Like so many of the tools that we share with all of our listeners and our students, this one is powerful because it invites you to really look at the very, very big picture and to drill down into the granular. It’s a makeup mirror, you know, magnifying everything 10 times, and it’s also like a giant understanding of let me look at all the moving pieces that are guiding me to some direction or to some place, and that’s why there seems to always be some type of affiliation of the concept of horoscopes or stars and fate. So can you speak to that?

Elizabeth Winkler: 31:12

I would like to hear your thoughts on that, on fate.

davidji: 31:17

As Mary Chapin Carpenter says, the stars may lie, but the numbers never do. I don’t know that. I even believe that. But you know, the stars move us towards a certain direction. They’ve existed for at least billions.

davidji: 31:29

Right, we know that our Earth, our bodies, were created at the heart of a star, a supernova that exploded, scattering stardust throughout the various galaxies. And what’s that? 3.9 billion years ago, a supernova that exploded, scattering stardust throughout the various galaxies. And what’s that? 3.9 billion years ago? So we know that we are made of this stuff. So I think there’s a deeper connection of our stardust essence. All the elements that are involved in that supernova explosion are the same elements that made up Earth and the same elements that have up Earth and the same elements that have made up our physical bodies, which means they have to have made up our brains and they have to have made up our hormones and they have to have made up how we act and what we do.

davidji: 32:09

So we are Stardust breathing Stardust. We are Stardust listening to Stardust. I am Stardust gazing into your Stardust eyes right now. It’s real stardust. I am stardust gazing into your stardust eyes. Right now, it’s real. So the concept of fate means that someone says something’s going to happen in the future, and then it does that someone could be God or some divine entity or some divine creator, or that could simply be you saying oh you’re a mean person, Meanness will befall you. Oh, you’re a good person, Good things will befall you. As simple as that. So destiny fate. I do believe in predeterminism and I didn’t want to muck up our podcast with that whole thing, but having sat down with the naughty palm leaf reader in Swami Malai for eight hours, Wait, wait.

Elizabeth Winkler: 32:55

You have to explain what that is. Okay, don’t just brush over the most amazing thing that ever happened. Okay, pause, rewind, retrograde, retrograde.

davidji: 33:07

Pause Notice. Pause Notice Settle.

Elizabeth Winkler: 33:09

Retrograde back for that.

davidji: 33:12

Let me retrograde that comment. Cancel clear. So yeah, I had the opportunity during my Eat Pray Love journey to visit the Nadi. What is the Nadi?

Elizabeth Winkler: 33:25

the Nadi is a not to be N-A-D-I, is that right?

davidji: 33:30

yeah, n-a-d-i not to be confused with Nadi which are those junctions, those 70 to 700,000 junction points that are associated with our meridians and our chakras and our acupressure, acupuncture layouts of our physical energy.

davidji: 33:47

So the Nadi is a shorthand for Nadi Jyotish, which means moon sign astrologer.

davidji: 33:55

And when you go to even deeper, one of their tools, the palm leaf, it’s maybe five inches wide and maybe three inches high and on it it’s thousands of years old and on it is written the entire story of your existence in ancient Tamil, not in Sanskrit, ancient Tamil.

davidji: 34:18

And you go to the Nadi palm leaf reader. This was written so long ago that it was written with lamp soot. So you know, back in the day, when they were like putting something, whether that’s a candle or some kind of you know oil inside to create a flame, the soot that was created from that light, maybe an ancient lantern or ancient whatever, they took that soot and then they etched, using that soot, onto these dried out palm leaves, and so the naughty palm leaf reader pretty much has like a sort of kind of a Rolodex, but it’s actually a ring with thousands and thousands of, and of course they say the knotty palm leaf reader only has the leaves of the people who are going to show up to have them read. So if you’re never going to show up to have your palm leaf read, it’s not there.

Elizabeth Winkler: 35:15

Can I ask a question? Yeah, so there’s only one leaf for each being.

Music: 35:21

Yes.

Elizabeth Winkler: 35:21

Okay, my mind’s blown. Yeah, yeah One leaf for each being Okay.

davidji: 35:27

There I was, in the middle of Tamil.

Elizabeth Winkler: 35:29

How did you find this? I mean, I’ve read the story but not everyone knows.

davidji: 35:32

I searched for months to ultimately discover this guy. I had heard about the Nadi In to ultimately discover this guy. I had heard about the naughty palm leaf and I was like what? And I was like I need to hook up with that and so I began my. That was sort of like part of my ePrayLove journey in search of the guru. I was searching for someone who was going to tell me and what’s on the leaf, your past life, your current life, right up to the moment of your death, and how you die and when you die, and your next life is actually on this leaf. Wow. And you go there and you give them your thumbprint and the naughty palm leaf reader meditates on your thumbprint for like 45 minutes and then he comes out and says these are the three leaves that speak to me more closely about this. So he pulls out the first leaf and it was like you are davidji, you live in France with your three children.

Elizabeth Winkler: 36:32

So he said and I’m like, literally no not me.

davidji: 36:35

Oh, then he pulls the next leaf. He goes you’re davidji, you live in Chinatown and you have eight children. And you have, you know, you’ve been married for 20 years. I’m like nope, not me. He’s like you’re davidji, your dad is J. You live in, literally said this yes, yes, jay. You live in, literally said this, yes, yes. And of course, I’m with a translator who translates from Hindi to English and so the Nadi only speaks Tamil and it’s a very grunty, very grunty kind of. I don’t mean any offense, it’s just reminds me of like Yoda yes, it’s very much like if Yoda was speaking Tamil.

davidji: 37:25

That’s what the Nadi essentially sounds like, you know and so but he’s speaking.

davidji: 37:30

So he’s staring at me. It’s just like I’m picturing Yoda. It’s just like you and me we’re staring at each other and Mateo’s on the end. So my translator was on the other end. So the 90s only looking at me, speaking to me. I don’t understand a word he’s saying, but I’m feeling the energy. And then my translator is saying to me. He says you are the davidji who lives in New York. And I’m like, yes, new York. And I’m like yes, and he’s like he said when you were three months old, you had a very, very horrible ear infection and you were deaf and had multiple surgeries. And I’m like what the? I’m like, yes, that’s actually true.

davidji: 38:15

And so he starts telling me all this stuff that happened between like one and 25, mentioning my mother’s death, mentioning all these things. And I’m like when you took my thumbprint, did you go into like the FBI records or something to like track down all this stuff? How is this even possible? You know, and this is pre all these devices, this is pre-internet searching Right, so there’s no way. So he lists like a health thing, a relationship, a death thing, like all that stuff.

davidji: 38:44

And I kept looking. I’m going like Nadi, you’re really good. And then he would go, you know, because I would say, nadi, you’re really good. And then my translator says to him you know. And then he replies back. And then my translator says to him you know, and then he replies back. And then my translator I’m like hanging on every word says back to me he says he’s just reading the leaf, no matter what he said. So the horrifying aspect of that was when he was telling me all the stuff from my past life. So if you tell me like, oh, here’s how you screwed up in this current life, you could say, all right, let me make amends and then let me try to do better. But when someone tells you that about your past life, well, you can’t do it.

Elizabeth Winkler: 39:28

Did he share your past life? Yeah, are you willing to share?

davidji: 39:30

No, Okay, no, but you know, suffice it to say there were things I did that I can’t go back into that life and change them and I can’t be different and I can’t choose differently. But here I am in this life, so I could sort of kind of undo that kind of karmic energy or just having it in my awareness. But most people say, well, wait, you know the moment of your death. I’m like, yeah, I know the moment of my death and I know how. Wait, he told you that like two hours together. But the person who was supposed to show up before me, they were flying from Germany and their flight got canceled. So instead of having a couple of hours, I spent eight hours with the naughty.

Elizabeth Winkler: 40:30

Wow.

davidji: 40:30

Taking copious, copious notes and I just had like this like a two hour massage. Prior to that, we did like two hours of yoga and an hour of like a two hour massage. Prior to that, we did like two hours of yoga and an hour of meditation and a two hour massage. So my hands are covered with oil and I keep trying to take notes on this pad. But once I get my hand on the pad covered with oil, the pen keeps skipping. So I’m like Natty another pen and he had like 20 pens and I just kept flipping the page and taking a new pen. So I have all this detailed information and the premise is for it to matter, you have to believe in predeterminism, right? Because the leaf says well, here’s what’s going to happen to you.

Elizabeth Winkler: 41:08

So what is his like takeaway to use what we talk about? Does he talk about how to work with energy or does he not give any advice? He just reads the leaf and leaves you.

davidji: 41:18

There’s only one advice that the Nadi gives Two prayer and charity. Say more oh, you want to change where you’re hurtling towards? Go to these nine temples and walk around them in prayer for an hour each. Oh, by the way, they’re about a thousand miles apart. So have fun on that journey. Nine temples and walk around them in prayer for an hour each. Oh, by the way, they’re about a thousand miles apart. So have fun on that journey. And as far as charity, divest yourself of anything that’s weighing you down energetically which, of course, is money as well as you make this journey with your first donation certainly being this is a free service oh it is yeah.

davidji: 41:59

so he’s counting on the kindness of strangers in this process. So, of course, my first donation was to the naughty and my second was to his physically challenged brother, and then to his town, and then to all these towns as I traveled around clearing my karma, as I prayed at all these various temples. So it’s only prayer and charity, that’s it. You want to live a good life, you want to pave the way in front of you, removing those obstacles. Prayer and charity. So, of course, if we’re charitable, we’re going to shift our internal, we’re going to keep moving towards our North Star, certainly, and we’re going to do it with kindness, compassion, perhaps forgiveness and love.

Elizabeth Winkler: 42:40

Amazing, In astrology there’s something called your North Node. Okay, your North Node is.

davidji: 42:49

Everything else seems to be planets, and then there are these nodes. So could you talk?

Elizabeth Winkler: 42:52

just a little bit.

davidji: 42:53

Well.

Elizabeth Winkler: 42:54

I’m just trying to connect to your thing, so to the naughty who I now permanently will see as Yoda. But anyway, the North Node is where you learn. It’s where you grow. So mine is in the seventh house. The seventh house is about relationships. Could be love relationship, but could be any relationship. I happen to work as a therapist. It’s a lot of relationships. Could be love relationship, but could be any relationship. I happen to work as a therapist. It’s a lot of relationships. I learn a lot in my work. That’s where I learn and grow the most. You could have your North Node. So it’s an interesting. There’s a astrologer who I’m very close with a close family friend and he does my chart every year. His name is Lawrence Hillman. His father was James Hillman, who was a revolutionary therapist and his focus is solely on that. Is that the true node?

davidji: 43:50

Yes, Minus cancer.

Elizabeth Winkler: 43:52

In what house? Third, third house. Okay, that’s communication, okay, yeah.

Music: 43:57

Also siblings. Okay, that’s communication.

Elizabeth Winkler: 43:58

Okay, yeah, also siblings, so you can learn a lot there. You can also learn a lot through communication.

davidji: 44:05

Yeah, let me pull up. And everybody, this is just me going to astrocom. I don’t have like a special connection and I didn’t have to pay anything. I did have to provide my email address, but how fascinating.

Elizabeth Winkler: 44:18

So your mind, your thinking, your communication, your siblings, your social activity, your neighbors, your early education. That’s where you learn and grow. For me, it’s in the seventh house, which is relationships, marriage contracts, business partners. I certainly learn a lot with you Equality, sharing, interpersonal style. So, anyway, you can get a download with all of the houses and what they are about on our website so that you can see where that North Node is and where you’re growing, and that might be really important for you to take a look at.

Elizabeth Winkler: 44:50

But there’s so many ways that we can work with this and work with the energy of, as I said, saturn, all of it. So we’ve only touched a little bit of the surface, but if you want to work with something more deliberately, I think the moon is a wonderful thing. So I mentioned full moon is about the illumination of something. It can be very emotional. The moon when it is full, when it is a dark sky, that is a new moon. The sun and moon are connected and that is a time to plant a seed, a new intention, and so every month we go through that process of planting a seed and then that completion. I know you talk about this all the time as well, but that’s a wonderful way to bring ritual into your life New moons, planting seeds, writing it down.

davidji: 45:43

And we have an episode on moons that’s separate from this, so I invite you to check it out.

Elizabeth Winkler: 45:49

So yeah. So planting seeds and new moons and then releasing what do I wanna let go of that no longer serves for full moons. So these are just a few little tidbits. We can go deeper, you can always reach out.

davidji: 46:00

What a rich episode, I mean, elizabeth. The amount of information that you just shared is so, so expansive, and I’m seeing it for me too.

Elizabeth Winkler: 46:09

I will tell you now that I look at people’s charts. I have hundreds of charts on file and I look at their charts every single time I’m like, oh my God, astrology is so powerful, it blows my mind. I think you have my chart, I do, and so when we and you’ll look at an event that happens on the planet and then look at the chart of that and it’s just all there. So it’s fascinating. The more you learn, the more you realize there’s a lot there and you can be not a victim of it. You can become empowered by working with the energies.

davidji: 46:43

And now it’s time for today’s take a day.

Elizabeth Winkler: 46:47

Take a day, any day, and do a chart for it.

davidji: 46:52

And now it’s time for today’s takeaway, which we lovingly call living the light.

Elizabeth Winkler: 46:59

Today’s takeaway is working with energy. You might not believe in anything around this. That’s totally fine. I don’t need you to. I’m not here to persuade you into that practice but energy is happening on the planet. We are on a planet and it is spinning in space and we forget that. We get lost in the personal planet of Elizabeth or the personal planet of Davy G. So get out of the personal planet. Remember you are stardust. Remember you’re on a planet and there’s a lot of forces that are happening that you don’t have control over. However, you are in a body on a planet and you have a control over aligning with this moment whatever’s happening and working with the energy creatively, and that is something that we all can do. So say yes to that and lean in and let go.

davidji: 48:02

So beautiful. Here we are on the third rock from the sun on the blue planet, spinning in space. In the podcast room, my name is davidji. I’m here with Elizabeth and Mateo and we are the shadow. I’m here with Elizabeth and Mateo and we are the Shadow and the Light Podcast. We’ll see you on the next episode. Check your star signs and trust that the universe will deliver you to exactly where you need to be.

Music: 48:45

In the meantime, Jam hidden pathways of the heart and that secret place. That is where I find my start. The light is here to remove all my fears and to bring new sight. The light if it’s on, then we’ll go to the deep to take me to new heights. The shadow and the light there’s hope out in the rock bottom. You hold it as your own limit, but don’t rush past this moment.

Music: 49:19

The darkness can become a friend. Love will come by your side and you’ll shine brighter than a million suns A million suns. You went through hell, but now you’re in the light. It’s here to remove all your fears and to bring new sight. The light is a light that will go to the deep to take you to the light. The light has come because of light. The light has come because it loves us. The light has come because it loves us. The light has come to set us free. The light has come to set us free. The shadow comes because it loves us. The shadow comes because it loves us. The shadow comes to set us free. The light is here to remove all our fears and to bring new life. The light is the light that will go on to the deep to take us to new heights. The shadow and the light.